UFO SCEPTICISME
Avertissement : UFO SCEPTICISME est un forum indépendant de toute association, groupe, structure, traitant du phénomène ovni.

Son administration se démarque et condamne fermement les activités prosélytes de partisans d'hypothèses exotiques non testables, non vérifiables à propos des PAN.

Avant l'inscription, merci de lire le règlement de l'hébergeur et le règlement particulier du forum. Pour cela, voir la rubrique "A lire avant de s'inscrire ou de poster".

Pour que l'inscription soit pérenne, le nouvel inscrit doit poster au moins un message dans les 8 jours après la validation de celle-ci.

Le forum UFO SCEPTICISME privilégie la participation par rapport au nombre d'inscrits.
UFO SCEPTICISME
Vous souhaitez réagir à ce message ? Créez un compte en quelques clics ou connectez-vous pour continuer.
UFO SCEPTICISME

UFOLOGIE ET SCEPTICISME

Derniers sujets
» Le « syndrome de La Havane » n’existe pas
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 EmptyAujourd'hui à 10:21 am par klingon

» Analyse des incidents d’objets volants aux États-Unis, 10 décembre 1948
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 EmptyAujourd'hui à 10:19 am par klingon

» Débat sur les PAN au Parlement européen
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 EmptyHier à 04:28 am par oncle dom

» Breaking news: Procédures de signalement des UAP à l’échelle mondiale - Circulaire GENADMIN
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty19/03/24, 04:45 pm par klingon

» Tim Gallaudet – Sous la surface
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty19/03/24, 03:28 am par oncle dom

» Rapport de l’AARO mars 2024 en Français
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty18/03/24, 04:15 pm par PhD Smith

» La Gravure de Nuremberg, 1561
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty14/03/24, 06:57 pm par oncle dom

» Les « sphères » d’Avi Loeb sont des polluants industriels
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty13/03/24, 12:25 am par klingon

» 2023 : Nouvelles découvertes sur l'épave d’Anticythère
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty10/03/24, 04:55 am par marcassite

» Kirkpatrick… en tant que chasseur d’OVNI du gouvernement américain
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty09/03/24, 08:32 pm par oncle dom

» Breaking News: Table ronde des médias sur le bureau AARO
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty09/03/24, 01:25 pm par PhD Smith

» Voyage à travers l'espace-temps | Expérience immersive
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty04/03/24, 01:50 pm par klingon

» MASTERPIECE: Gimbal UFO – Une nouvelle analyse
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty25/02/24, 05:44 pm par klingon

» Netflix: R..., le prophète des extra-terrestre
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty23/02/24, 08:46 pm par PhD Smith

» Les Chiasmophanies
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Empty21/02/24, 07:35 am par oncle dom

Sujets similaires
Le Deal du moment : -29%
PC portable Gamer ERAZER DEPUTY P60 – ...
Voir le deal
999.99 €

Vous n'êtes pas connecté. Connectez-vous ou enregistrez-vous

Cash-Landrum 29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS

+18
John_Carter
sentry579
Sebastien
oncle dom
RAF
Mattouze
lilith_unique
R.C
Curieuse
PhD Smith
Nicolas M.
hal9000
NEMROD34
DAR
Jeansériel
Patrice
nablator
marcassite
22 participants

Aller à la page : Précédent  1 ... 11 ... 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23  Suivant

Aller en bas  Message [Page 19 sur 23]

nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

Sebastien a écrit:J'ai mappé la carte de Wim Van Utrecht sur Google Earth et mis en évidence la raffinerie en question. Qu'est-ce que vous utilisez pour partager un fichier en ligne? scratch 
Rapidshare.com ?
Box.com ?
C'est quoi comme fichier ? Kmz ?

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

oncle dom

oncle dom

Sebastien a écrit: Qu'est-ce que vous utilisez pour partager un fichier en ligne? scratch 
Ca dépend de de la taille du fichier. Pour moins de 8192 Ko, il y a http://cjoint.com/
Sinon, il y a ceux répertoriés sur cette page
Malheureusement, elle n'est pas à jour.

http://oncle-dom.fr/index.htm

Sebastien

Sebastien
Modération
Modération

Kmz file of Wim Van Utrecht's map:
http://cjoint.com/?CKwwFRi0A5s

It looks like this:
https://i.servimg.com/u/f57/15/04/82/62/map-wi11.jpg


_________________
Tout se passe comme si l'HSP/TRC était vraie, ou que l'HET était rare.

marcassite

marcassite
Membre d'honneur
Membre d'honneur

Selon la carte de Wim V.Utrecht,
si l'ovni est vu au point 2 "en face" et au point 6 "dans le rétro/lunette arrière", la source (flamme de torchère, lumière) ne peut être qu'à un seul endroit logiquement : au croisement des axes des 2 routes respectives. Bref il y a un bug dans l'histoire.

Sinon l'axe de vue en 2 pointe bien sur les raffineries Total et Shell de Deer Point.
http://goo.gl/maps/lAAOz

S'il y a eu un dégazage de flamme exceptionnel d'une torchère, c'est qu'il y a eu un petit incident de production qui est forcément noté dans les archives de ces raffineries... si elles ont des archives.

Voir aussi si les conditions météo collaient avec le type de cristaux/nuages.=> prendre contact avec un ufologue US qui contacterait un météorologue texan qui trouverait l'info ? Sad

C'est une hypothèse à creuser sérieusement.
Je note que Wim V.U conforte l'idée d'une intox alimentaire avec une citation (schuessler) "perhaps it was something he had eaten at the truck stop in New Caney"...

Sebastien

Sebastien
Modération
Modération

Pour l'alopécie, le stress peut en être la cause. Je connais deux cas personnellement malheureusement. Et quand on sait que le témoin cité par Van Utrecht a lui aussi pensé à la venue de Jésus, on peut penser que cette vision doit avoir un petit effet de stress.

Pour le point 6 de la carte, tu notes un point à éclaircir effectivement. Qui dit qu'elles voyaient la colonne dans le rétroviseur? D'ailleurs il serait bon d'avoir tous les textes qui ont permis cette reconstitution. Sentry have you an idea what the sources are for Van Utrecht's map?

Pour la météo, peut-être que quelqu'un ici connait un site performant capable de se remonter aussi loin?


_________________
Tout se passe comme si l'HSP/TRC était vraie, ou que l'HET était rare.

Invité


Invité

Sebastien a écrit:Very interesting theory that we'll have to dig a little bit. The linked image isn't visible in the text of Wim. Here it is I think: http://www.caelestia.be/reflections/reflections-fig1.jpg
Je viens de recevoir un e-mail de Wim. J'ai demandé si je pouvais partager certaines informations qu'il a apportées (en plus des suivantes) en nous lisant.
En fait, l'image serait plutôt celle-ci et légendée comme vous lirez... Très intéressant et surtout magnifique (même s'il s'agit de L.P verticaux).

Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 OP-PH-21
Légende:
On January 7, 2007, an equipment malfunction triggered an emergency flaring at the Dutch manufacturing company of Dow Chemical in Terneuzen. The huge flame that accompanied the excessive gas emission produced a bright reflection that stirred commotion in the provinces of Zeeland (the Netherlands) and Oost-Vlaanderen (Belgium). Inspired by witnesses who believed that the second coming of Christ was at hand, newspapers and television stations spoke of the return of the Star of Bethlehem. Fortunately, members of the Philippus Langsbergen Observatory in Middelburg were interviewed as well. Since they were acquainted with the phenomenon of gas-flame reflections, their explanations helped put matters to rest.

The picture above was taken by a member of the observatory and published the next day by the local newspaper Provinciale Zeeuwse Courant and de national paper De Telegraaf. See next images for three more pictures of this same reflection taken by other amateur astronomers.
Wim m'a également fait part de cette vidéo. Il s'agit d'un L.P. qui fut causé par un feu et l'explosion d'un pipe-line... Very Rare and impressive (vertical again).

sentry579

sentry579

Wim van Utrecht has kindly allowed me to publish a revised version of his unpublished 2002 Cash-Landrum examination: http://www.blueblurrylines.com/2013/11/cash-landrum-theory-analysis.html

Also, a video slideshow of Vickie's NUFORC call:

http://blueblurrylines.blogspot.com/

nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

sentry579 a écrit:Also, a video slideshow of Vickie's NUFORC call:
"It come down almost to the treetops, and then it went back up and went to the right of us."

How high would treetops be from Vickie's point of view? From the Bergstrom Interview, 60 to 80 feet above and 130 feet distance would be between 27° and 38° of altitude. This angle and a little calculation from meteorological data could yield a lower bound to the distance to the hypothetical reflected flame.

If Vickie is correct, the flame would also have to be moving to the right.

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

Invité


Invité

Sentry579 a écrit:Wim van Utrecht has kindly allowed me to publish a revised version of his unpublished 2002 Cash-Landrum examination: http://www.blueblurrylines.com/2013/11/cash-landrum-theory-analysis.html
Again, it is a very interesting piste/hypothesis (and a new one).
If I'm correct, LP may be seen by individuals, but not by others, depending the point(s) of location they are situated. It could explain why not so much other witnesses saw it. The L.P. phenomenon being "intrinsically" rare, well we have a good potential "explanation" why the sighting is resisting, and why the witnesses have been "legitimately" surprised. Beyond this explanation is pointing a real stimulus, well matching with what is described (taking into account how narratives may be more or less well describing what it is realy seen), we have an economical explanation.
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 CASH-LANDRUM-comparison

The "problem" is that not the "full" Cash-Landrum file is addressed by Wim's excellent article, noticeably the "Helicopters" chapter/ingredient.
As Curt wrote in his comments section: [quote] Obviously, it doesn't fully account for many other elements in the case, but I'm glad Wim has taken a serious look at it, and considered that there was a genuine event at the core of the story. I'm hoping Wim will offer further opinions once he's had a chance to absorb more of the recent material.[/img]

But well, IFO studies (aka UFO cases explained) show how legacies are sometimes “cumulating” many conventional variables, from real stimulus observed to "embellishments", projective transpositions, etc. and then how some IFO cases are in reality very complex, even if they are, in reality, involving "conventional" variables (in interaction).
Like other "good and solid" cases (ie: RB47H), it is possible many conventional variables are in interaction (if cases in reality involving no “fortean” entities), and then a posteriori, it is more or less "impossible" to solve such cases definitively.
I'm humblely among the ones who think, it is one the reasons why we will have ALWAYS unsolvable cases, even if this UFO phenomenon had nothing Fortean...
Dunno if clear enough.
Gilles.

sentry579

sentry579

nablator a écrit:[ From the Bergstrom Interview, 60 to 80 feet above and 130 feet distance ...
About this measurements you mention. These are from the Schuessler & Holt trip to the scene with Vickie & Colby on Feb. 28, 1981 to the road. Not the exact spot as revealed in TDH documents. I have doubts about how closely she could determine the distance of the bright object from the car. At the scene, Vickie described events and measurements were taken of the estimated distance. These measurements were circulated and the witnesses began using them instead of their own words to describe the case. Since Holt, an engineer, was present, I do place some trust in these estimates.

There is one helpful and unique detail in Allan Hendry's report, in his interview with Vickie, she told him the object was larger than her outstretched hand.

On to what Gilles is saying about cumulative stimuli. While unlikely, if we are going to consider "ET", we have to look at Klass-type explanations as well. The adult witnesses originally were not able to tell if they were seeing helicopters or airplanes, which would seem to indicate they were distant. It could it be possible that they saw lights from air traffic to and from the Houston airport, and the excitement of the moment caused them to associate it with their experience. When they discussed what they'd seen, perhaps they speculated that it was helicopters, and sketchy details became case facts.

Just speculation, but it allows a genuine series of events or stimulus, rather than just calling it all a hoax.

http://blueblurrylines.blogspot.com/

nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

sentry579 a écrit:I have doubts about how closely she could determine the distance of the bright object from the car.
Sure. Competent investigators would have taken measurements of angles, not distances that are wildly inaccurate. It doesn't matter if the distances are right or not, I'm just looking for an estimation of the minimum (angular) altitude of the center of the apparition. Let's say not less than about 30°. Then I'll have to remember how to calculate the altitude of the hypothetical ice crystals layer from surface temperature, dew point, etc. that are not precisely known. We only have records from the Houston airport.

The adult witnesses originally were not able to tell if they were seeing helicopters or airplanes, which would seem to indicate they were distant.
Where did you get this from? Shocked

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

sentry579

sentry579

http://www.theblackvault.com/encyclopedia/documents/MUFON/Journals/1983/September_1983.pdf a écrit:Tape Recording Made At Parkway
Hospital On 1 February 1981
(Approx.), and Furnished To Bill
English at APRO
Betty said, after getting back into
the car at the initial sighting scene, that
the object went up into the sky, and
"but there was a quite a few helicopters
circling around. I don't know whether
they were trying to get around it or up
closer to it or what, to see maybe what it
was."
Betty said, when they stopped on
the Huffman-Crosby road, "but at this
time I counted 23 helicopters, around
and about the object. They were far
away but yet they were low enough and
we set there and watched them 'till they
got over the car because I wanted to
make sure if it was airplanes or if it was
helicopters, which it was helicopters. I
counted 23 of them. I don't know what
color they were, I can't say. But I do
know that they had a double deal on the
top, propeller-like thing. And I could
hear 'em just as plain as if they were
right ready to land...."
This tape is also transcribed in Schuessler's book, page 39.

Edited to add:
This tape was made shortly after Vickie's call to NUFORC. This was produced at the request of Bill english of APRO, who was selling the story to the Weekly World News. It would be 20 days later before John Schuessler became involved in the case. JS did not have access to this tape until it was recovered from APRO in 1982.



Dernière édition par sentry579 le 27/11/13, 03:17 pm, édité 1 fois (Raison : addition)

http://blueblurrylines.blogspot.com/

Invité


Invité

The adult witnesses originally were not able to tell if they were seeing helicopters or airplanes, which would seem to indicate they were distant.
If  sourced, and in the "first" interviewes, that's realy interesting imho... EDIT: you provided an excerpt (our comments crossing^^).**
You well know that, more and more times you are interviewed (or restoring events in memory), and more and more you are re-structuring it, and going "fare away" the "initial" event you are narrating.  "Embellishments" comes into play and becomes part of a "sensational narrative", as often including as new "parts" of your narrative what is offered by your interviewer and investigator (John Shuesler ie.), by articles/newspapers about you and your story, etc. In other words, external infos (in reality) become taking part your narrative, as "exagerations", as what have a special interest for others (investigators, newspapers, etc). It is mainly not consciously done or made (then, it is not the witnesses who are hoaxing, lying...), but involving mere suggestion/suggestibility processings...

Psychologists are agreed that even if the first time you are restoring an event/stimulus in memory, that's already a re-construction of it, and not the instant "photo" of this stimulus/event.

I particulary like the definition of retrospective falsification, something probably at play concerning its  famous case, or not. Dunno, if not impossible to proove, but well something probably to take into the "equation":

D. H. Rawcliffe coined this term to refer to the process of telling a story that is factual to some extent, but which gets distorted and falsified over time by retelling it with embellishments. The embellishments may include speculations, conflating events that occurred at different times or in different places, and the incorporation of material without regard for accuracy or plausibility. The overriding force that drives the story is to find or invent details that fit with a desired outcome. The process can be conscious or unconscious. The original story gets remodeled with favorable points being emphasized and unfavorable ones being dropped. The distorted and false version becomes a memory and record of a remarkable tale. [...] The term is used in psychology to describe the process of creating false memories by selecting and reshaping incidents from the past to fit present needs. Retrospective falsification occurs in most, if not all, people and is generally an unconscious process.
source: http://www.skepdic.com/retfalse.html

** PS: this excerpt could be interpreted differently than "were not able to tell if they were seeing helicopters or airplanes", because in the sequence of its narrative she is "confirming" it was helico...
But well, again, narratives are complexe and should be recorded "immediatly" after an event, to avoid the processings I mentionned fastly. Of course, that's impossible...

Amitiés,

Gilles

nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

sentry579 a écrit:This tape is also transcribed in Schuessler's book, page 39.
All right, but Betty did state unambiguously that she recognized helicopters as soon as she had a good look "over the car". You made it sound as if the witnesses were unsure if they were seeing helicopters or airplanes. If "originally" means before they came "over the car", I agree.

N.B. I'm not saying "they DID see helicopters". To me the whole episode sounds like a nightmare. You know, being unable to move while something awful is happening. Something that doesn't have to make sense, like being slowly roasted alive and doing nothing to protect oneself.

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

sentry579

sentry579

You are right, I overstated the uncertainty. It is an interesting detail, though, given how clearly JS says the helicopters were said to be seen. That quote also seems to place the helicopters firmly at a later stop and not at the initial UFO location.

This points out an important thing about the sighting, that it was really a series of events which ran over the course of several miles. I'm going to have to go back yet another time to the earliest accounts to try to separate the sequence of events from later "memory falsification". But from my memory, JS has most of the helicopter action and counting at the cemetery, but the witnesses placed it at the stop sign on the east side of Huffman. It could be that JS felt that weakened the story by having the copters so near the city- just speculating.

http://blueblurrylines.blogspot.com/

nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

sentry579 a écrit:It could be that JS felt that weakened the story by having the copters so near the city- just speculating.
Yes...
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Pious_fraud

Did you investigate the allegation about a Lenticular Reentry Vehicle?
(No idea what connection could exist.)
http://robert-barrow.blogspot.fr/2013/07/cash-landrum-and-lorenzen.html

Also could it have been some kind of psychedelic or hypnotic state induced by microwaves or chemical poisoning? Just speculating. Smile

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

sentry579

sentry579

Nab, you've given me a term today for a concept I didn't know already had a name: "pious fraud", a believer who will "help" miracles happen in order to share his faith.
This made me recall the comic book hero, Peacemaker, who loves peace so much he is willing to fight for it!
The pious fraud loves truth so much, he is willing to lie for it!
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 The-pe10

The LRV angle seems a dead end. I've asked for those who support a nuclear-powered vehicle to provide an example of an active program during the time frame but they have nothing. I just don't believe such projects can be kept secret, only perhaps details about their purpose and utilization.

The thought that the experience was internal was dismissed by the original investigator, so I'm inclined to take another look at it. Trouble, big trouble is getting the same story to appear in 3 people's heads- much easier to believe for just one witness. Dr. Hynek and John Alexander both said, there were no helicopters, and that they were some kind of projection, mental or holographic, somehow also able to interact with the environment. Both men also consider paranormal explanations for UFOs. (Magic explains everything, as it is not bound by physics!)

Stressful encounters can induce disassociated hypnotic states, but I'm not sure they typically result in distortions large enough to produce an epic UFO story.

As to the mention of microwaves, Alexander and his friend, Captain Paul Tyler, MD were informally consulted by the DAIG. Both Tyler and Alexander have studied the use of microwaves in secret military weapon systems. Ooh, spooky...

http://blueblurrylines.blogspot.com/

marcassite

marcassite
Membre d'honneur
Membre d'honneur

If I'm correct, LP may be seen by individuals, but not by others, depending the point(s) of location they are situated. It could explain why not so much other witnesses saw it.
Je ne suis pas d'accord sur ce point qui pose problème (avec le point 6 de la carte) . Les piliers de lumière sont visibles sous divers angles (hauteurs) et diverses positions autour de la source (puisque les cristaux sont horizontaux) => témoins nombreux. D'autant plus que la distance d'observation peut être à plusieurs dizaines de km de la source (comme le dit Wim V.Utrecht) !

http://www.atoptics.co.uk/halo/lpil.htm
http://www.atoptics.co.uk/halo/pilpic22.htm
Il y a un cas en amérique latine près d'un aéroport (mais je ne me remémore plus le cas) qui avait été expliqué ainsi et il y eut de nombreux témoins.

Enfin même si la thèse est très séduisante, il manque quand même le principal : attester de la présence des cristaux en date et heure (=> météo sol et alti non fournie par Wim) et/ou attester d'un lâcher exceptionnel de torchère, d'un incendie.

Sinon c'est intéressant de voir un cas de pilier au dessus d'une raffinerie de ... Dow Chemical dans la doc de Wim V.U.


nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

I couldn't find any refinery fire mentioned in newspapers in the Houston area for December 29 in newspaperarchive.com. There was only one in Kansas, far away to the north, and it was out shortly after dawn on Monday (29) :
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1755&dat=19801230&id=c54cAAAAIBAJ&sjid=42cEAAAAIBAJ&pg=5565,7471511

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

Invité


Invité

marcassite a écrit:
If I'm correct, LP may be seen by individuals, but not by others, depending the point(s) of location they are situated. It could explain why not so much other witnesses saw it.
Je ne suis pas d'accord sur ce point qui pose problème (avec le point 6 de la carte) . Les piliers de lumière sont visibles sous divers angles (hauteurs) et diverses positions autour de la source (puisque les cristaux sont horizontaux) => témoins nombreux.
Hello Marcassite,

Faudrait voir avec un spécialiste (que je ne suis pas), mais j'aurais tendance à maintenir ce que j'ai écrit.

Je comprends que seuls les cristaux se trouvant sur une colonne à peu près à mi-chemin entre la source de lumière et l'observateur vont faire "miroir et reflet", et produire un L.P. pour l'observateur. De la, il serait impossible pour un observateur pourtant pas si loin d'observer le L.P. si ces "angles égaux" ne sont pas les mêmes. En gros, sur le schéma suivant, si la distance change entre l'observateur et la source (ils ne sont pas à "mi-chemin"), l'observateur qui regarderait dans la direction, ne verra rien.

Only crystals on a column roughly midway between the light and the observer give a reflection into the eye because the small crystal mirrors are nearly horizontal and the incident and reflected rays must make equal angles to the crystal faces.
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 Zenli


Source : http://www.atoptics.co.uk/halo/pilpic22.htm

nablator

nablator
Administration
Administration

Gilles F. a écrit:Faudrait voir avec un spécialiste (que je ne suis pas), mais j'aurais tendance à maintenir ce que j'ai écrit.
Ce serait étonnant que les cristaux de glace ne se forment qu'à un endroit précis. Les conditions météorologiques varient très peu sur quelques km.

http://nabbed.unblog.fr/

marcassite

marcassite
Membre d'honneur
Membre d'honneur

Je n'arrive pas à accéder aux archives des radiosondages USA texas par ex ici :
http://nomads.ncdc.noaa.gov/cgi-bin/ncdc-ui/igra/param2-station.cgi


Faudrait voir avec un spécialiste.
Ainsi soit-il. Tu en connais un ? Smile 
Je reste convaincu, japdc, qu'un" miroir au plafond" (= grand nuage de cristaux) renvoie la lumière en de nombreux points autour de la source.
A moins que le nuage ne soit très localisé dans ce cas il faut un alignement source/nuage/témoin qui restreint les positions de vision. D'où la nécessité des données météo et radiosondages.

EDIT : la position du Lac Houston entre la source et les témoins pourrait-elle expliquer un nuage spécifique localisé (au dessus du lac) ??

Pour Nab, ne pas chercher qu'un incendie de raffinerie mais un incident technique qui impliquerait un gros lâcher à la torchère d'une raffinerie (ou d'un terminal gazier portuaire). Je l'ai vu 2 fois , c'est impressionnant même de loin.

Invité


Invité

Je ne sais pas Nab.
Mais bon, le nuage de cristaux à une forme qui peut varier, et peut-être qu'à différent endroits, même si tu te déplaces, tu vas l'observer ce L.P., du moment que cette règle des angles "égaux" et du "mi-chemin" est maintenue.
Tu me rétorqueras - à raison - que je dis que je dis une chose (il y a des conditions particulières pour voir un LP suivant l'angle observateur/source avec les cristaux, pouvant expliquer pourquoi "pas" d'autres témoins), puis son "contraire" (un même observateur pourra l'observer plusieurs fois même s'il se déplace, mais pourquoi pas d'autres témoins).
J'en suis conscient.
Mais bon, peut-être qu'à situation "exceptionnelle", témoignage exceptionnel et singulier.
http://www.atoptics.co.uk/halo/images1/shim18.gif
Cash-Landrum  29 décembre 1980 DAYTON TEXAS - Page 19 2cmj

Invité


Invité

Pour Nab, ne pas chercher qu'un incendie de raffinerie mais un incident technique qui impliquerait un gros lâcher à la torchère d'une raffinerie (ou d'un terminal gazier portuaire).
Yesterday and days before, I tried to consult online area "newspapers" archives in order to see if a conflagration, oil refineries technical problem, etc. have been recorded in time and place of the sighting.
That's very difficult from France and online sources are rare (or you must pay to have access) I must say. Sad
Maybe Outer-Atlantic, such "exercice" to consult local archives will or is already intended?

marcassite

marcassite
Membre d'honneur
Membre d'honneur

Pour l'instant j'ai trouvé uniquement ceci :

http://weather.uwyo.edu/cgi-bin/sounding?region=naconf&TYPE=TEXT%3ALIST&YEAR=1980&MONTH=12&FROM=2912&TO=3000&STNM=72240

Donc marre de chercher dans le vide, j'ai envoyé 2 courriels à des universités avec dpt meteo (j'espère qu'ils vont saisir mon frangliche!) pour avoir des données de décembre 80 au TX.

Contenu sponsorisé



Revenir en haut  Message [Page 19 sur 23]

Aller à la page : Précédent  1 ... 11 ... 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23  Suivant

Permission de ce forum:
Vous ne pouvez pas répondre aux sujets dans ce forum